Question on "mappings as cache"
Jonathan S. Shapiro
shap at eros-os.org
Mon Dec 8 16:01:39 CET 2003
On Mon, 2003-12-08 at 09:30, Espen Skoglund wrote:
> [Jonathan S Shapiro]
> > A maps some region to B
> > B completes the receive operation, and therefore
> > now has a copy of the mapping
> > B is immediately preempted, before it can do any user-level
> > book keeping about the mapping
> > ... other stuff runs ...
> > kernel runs out of mapping cache space, chooses to evict
> > the mapping just received by B
> > ... other stuff runs ...
> > B attempts to reference the region that it believes should
> > be mapped, and page faults.
> > Can someone explain the process by which B is able to get the
> > mapping reconstructed?
> A really quick answer:
> B's pager, Pb, receives the page fault
> Pb requests the mapping from A
> Note that Pb and A could here be the same thread...
This makes sense to me, but it also seems to me that if A is a process
implementing the file server, and B has memory mapped a file from A,
then the current design requires Pb to act as an intermediary --
primarily for the purpose of normalizing file offsets and doing a little
bit of protocol translation.
Further, it seems to me that there is an interesting problem of
deceiting here, since the file server may not know that Pb and B are
equivalent for access control purposes.
Am I missing something that simplifies this scenario?
> A longer answer would require a better understanding of our concept of
> "data spaces", "data space managers", and "region maps" . Here's a
> rather shortish explanation of this scheme:
> Data space: An unstructured data container, e.g., a file, anonymous
> memory, pinned memory, etc.
> Data space manager: A server that manages accesses to a particular
> data space. The data space manager will typically have parts
> (or the whole) of the data space mapped into its own address
> space. It will map these parts off to clients.
> Region map: A region map is a part of the client's address space
> that contains parts (or the whole) of a data space. Note that
> the region map need not be fully populated. If the client
> accesses a part of the region which is not mapped, a page fault
> will be generated.
> Region mapper: The region mapper serves as the page fault handler
> for the threads within the client. The region mapper keeps
> track of all region maps attached to the address space. When
> the region mapper catches page faults it translated these page
> faults into requests that are forwarded to the respective data
> space manager.
Okay. This is roughly the model that I was reconstructing from first
principles. I will try to use these terms from here on to avoid
Based on your description, I am now reasonably convinced that the L4
operations are individually faster, but that the collective end to end
protocol needed to resolve page faults when data spaces are involved may
be significantly more complicated in L4 than it is in EROS. I suspect
that the aggregate end to end costs in L4 are likely to be *slower* than
EROS, but at best they are going to be very similar.
> For B to access parts of the data space, the following
> steps would typically be taken (Rm = region mapper, Dm = data space
> 1. Rm: Create region (R)
> 2. Rm: Request data space manager (Dm) to attach a data space (D)
> to R.
> 3. B: Touch some memory in R. Nothing is mapped yet and a page
> fault is therefore raised.
> 4. Rm: Receive page fault and use virtual address to identify
> 5. Rm: Request Dm to map parts of the data space to R.
> 6. Dm: Map parts of D to R.
> An obvious optimization here is for Rm to request parts of the region
> map to be pre-populated before step 3.
A better optimization might be to provide sufficient information to the
kernel so that it can more directly localize the correct fault handler.
Or perhaps the L4 design embeds a philosophical argument that resolving
these things at user level is (a) feasible and (b) likely as efficient
than any kernel implementation, and therefore should not be done in the
kernel? If so, I understand the philosophical point, and I am not sure
that I agree. In my mind, the answer depends on what gets the job done
best on an end to end basis.
Please note that I'm not advocating placing policy in the kernel here.
I'm wondering if there might be a better *mechanism* by which to express
the user-desired policy.
> [Hmm... my "short" answer turned out to be a bit longer than
Perhaps so, but it was VERY helpful!
More information about the l4-hackers